sonable way in which that Bill had been brong it before their Lordships. It came up to them in such a manner that no Amendments in it could be properly considered. For his own part, he passively submitted in this case to what had taken place; but he thought that the measure ought to have reached them at an earlier period of the Session. They had not even before them the evid-nee taken by the Select Committee of the other House on the subject, and their Lordships were putting themselves too much in the position of a mere Registry of the decrees of the House of Commons; and they ought to be careful how they gave further encourage. ment to that tendency. He was, how ever, aware that the evils connected with the collection of extraordinary tithe had been great under the present state of things; and, hoping that that measure might lead to peace and cause no great diminution of income to the elergy, as a landowner he was ready to submit to its passing.

it stood for a second reading by their Lordships before most of them had even seen it in print; it was presented to them without their having had an opportunity of seeing the evidence upon which it rested; and they were now asked to rush it through in the last hours of an expiring Parliament. The Bill, if passed, could only be carried out by a system of espionage; he believed that it was unworkable, and that those who were pushing it forward knew that it was unworkable, but they hoped when it was found to be so that they would be able to insist on dealing with adult labour by the same kind of legislation as they now sought to deal with the labour of young persons. A main reason for the existence of the House of Lords was that it should be a check on crude and hasty legislation. The country would be disappointed if the Lords did not act as a Court of Appeal on legislation of this character, and insist that full knowledge and time should be given for the consideration of a Bill of such a grave character. The agitation on this subject had been orAmendment reported (according to ganized by Mr. Sutherst, standing councrder; further Amendments made: sel to the Salvation Army, and its object Then Standing Order No. XXXV. was, not to limit the hours of labour of condered according to order and dis-persons below 18, but "effectually to pined with: Bill read 3, with the Amen Iments, and passed, and sent to the Commons; and to be printed as amended. No. 203.)

Motion agreed to.

SHOP HOURS REGULATION BILL.
The Ind Sulley,
No. 199. REPORT.
Order of the Day for receiving the
Report of the Amendments read.

Mael, "That the said Report be now reveived.”— The Lord Sudeley.

THE EARL OF WEMYSS, in rising to move, as an Amendment

reduce the hours of labour in shops and similar places." That meant the shutting up of shops and interfering with adult male labour, which was a new principle. If their Lordships passed this Bill in its pre-ent crude form, and without any prospect of its being brought into actual operation, they would before the end of next Session have a Bill to regulate all labour in shops. That would be an intolerable tyranny, an intolerable interference with the trade of this country. When he and those who agreed with him raised this question they were met by moral lessons from the Episcopal Bench and from a lay Bishop, the noble Duke the Duke of Argyll, and were told that the principle of the Bill was in the Factory Acts. said that that measure had been brought But their Lordships ought to have bebefore their Lordships under such cir- fore them the evidence upon which the cunstances and in such a way that, measure rested. The Chairman of the considering the importance of the sub- Shopkeepers' Defence Ass ciation wrote ject, as affecting the retail trade of the to him to say that though over 60 witwhole Kingdom, it was not desirablenesses had been examined before the that the Bill should now proceed fur-¡ Committee of the House of Commons, ther. It had been hurried through the only seven were examined on the side

That it is not desire le to proved further with this Bill until the evilence up on the sb. t tik n by the Select Committee of the Hf Commons has been communicated to

fore, was that if the evidence was before | Sir John Lubbock. He was one of their Lordships they would find it to be the most eminent men in the country, unsatisfactory. The Committee was not and by no means a man who would take unanimous. A counter Report was up a measure of this kind from any feeldrafted and laid before the Committee ing of fanaticism, but one who would by Sir James Fergusson, in which it deal calmly and coolly with the evidence was stated that some of the witnesses before him. The noble Earl denounced expressed a willingness to accept the the principle of this Bill, denying that Bill as a step in the right direction. it had any analogy to the Factory Acts. His experience was that steps in the To his mind the Bill contained exactly right direction were strides in the wrong. the same principle as the Factory Acts. The conclusion to which Sir James Fer- Every large shop might become a facgusson came was that the evils com- tory, though, no doubt, it was an extenplained of were not so great as to re- sion of the principle of factory legislaquire a legislative remedy. The Factory tion to apply it to shops. The question Inspectors themselves said that the Fac- was whether the evidence before them tory Acts had no bearing on the labour justified that extension. employed in shops. He was not opposed to the principle of the Bill, but he looked to its practical effect. He did not believe that this Bill would be good for the young people themselves. Practically, kindly feeling, philanthropy, and the pressure of public opinion were effecting all that the Bill aimed at. The noble Earl concluded by moving the Amendment which stood in his name.

THE EARL OF WEMYSS: There is no evidence.

THE DUKE OF ARGYLL: Although they had not the evidence taken by the Select Committee of the House of Commons before them, they knew perfectly well, from the discussions which had taken place in the public Press, that the attendance of young persons, and especially of young women and girls in shops, was sometimes very great indeed and most injurious. Under these circumTo leave out all the words after ("That ") and insert (it is not desirable to proceed far-stances, he trusted that their Lordships ther with this Bill until the evidence upon the would not be induced by the somewhat subject taken before the Select Committee of fanatical denunciations of the noble Earl the House of Commons has been communicated to reject the Bill. to this House.")-(The Earl of Wemyss.)

Amendment moved,

LORD ELLENBOROUGH said, that he objected to the Bill because its effect would be to close shops in poor districts at times when they were now kept open to suit the needs of the inhabitants.

THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURY wished to say that he was guided in this matter by the principle which he enunciated last night. The principle of this Bill was sound. It was a principle which had again and again been sanctoned by the Legislature, and he did not feel justified in rejecting a Bill of which the principle was sound unless some specific evil or inconvenience could be shown to be likely to result from it. In the present case no evil or inconvenience had been shown as likely to be produced by the Bill, and, therefore, in his opinion, there was no ground for rejecting the measure.

THE DUKE OF ARGYLL said, that the noble Earl the Earl of Wemyss) had referred to him as a member of a Society for promoting the objects of this Bill. He had not been a member of that Society, because he had made it a rule in his public life never to join any Society whatever of a political character, for he had ascertained that membership of such a Society almost always converted a man, otherwise sensible, into a fanatic. For that reason it would have been better if his noble Friend had not joined and become Chairman of another Society, for in his speech that night his noble Friend had shown himself to be Standing Order No. XXXV. cona lay fanatic. Although he knew no-sidered according to order), and disthing of the Society to which the noble pensed with: Bill read 3, with the Earl had referred, he did know some- Amendments, and passed, and sent to thing of the Gentleman who was in the Commons; and to be printed as charge of this Bill in "another place" amended. No. 204.)

to be left out stand part of the Motion? On Question, That the words proposed Resolved in the Affirmative: Amendments reported accordingly.

INTOXICATING LIQUORS (SALE TO
CHILDREN) BILL.-(No. 176.)

(The Earl of Milltown,}
COMMITTEE.

House in Committee according to order).

Clause 1 (Sale of liquors to children to be illegal.

Amendment moved, in page 1, line 8, leave out (supplies") and insert ("sells"-(The Earl of Multoun.)

THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURY said, he did not think that the Bill would increase the admiration which was felt for such specimens of legislation as that under consideration; but he thought the Amendment now proposed would meet objections which were felt in many quarters to the Bill, and, therefore, he did not propose to offer any opposition

to its passing.

precepts by law would be likely to destroy the self-restraint of individuals, by teaching them to rely upon the State for that which every individual should do from his own sense of right. He confessed that he felt that the effect of carrying prohibitive legislation to the extent of the Bill before the House

would be far different from what the lieved, showed that most of the great promoters anticipated. History, he beevils from which society had suffered had resulted from the State trying to do the work which the Church should have done, and also from the Church's attempting to do that which should have been done by the State; and he feared they were now doing many things by the State which ought to be left to the Church. That was not the first occasion in which he had upheld a reasonable and common-sense policy in opposition to purely fanatical views. He, nevertheless, believed that a man was more safe in kicking over a hornet's nest than in encountering a fanatic.

LORD ABERDARE observed, that the right rev. Prelate night have gone a little. further and said whether ho opposed all legislative efforts in the direction of the promotion of temperance. The question before the House was whether young children were to be supplied with drink for their own consumption.

VISCOUNT CRANBROOK said, that that was just what the Bill did not prevent. What it did prevent, however, was children fetching beer in their own jugs for the use of their parents, who, being poor people, did not keep servants and who were unable to fetch it themselves,

THE BISHOP OF PETERBOROUGH | (Dr. MAOEK) said, that while he was as strongly in favour of temperance as any one could possibly be, yet he deprecated polemical legislation of the kind, and the passing of laws to enforce morality by means of severe penalties. He was aware of the oblcquy to which he had exposed himself on previous occasions by advocating that view; but he felt bound to express his extreme objection to legislation which connived at promoting morality by penal enactment. It was not the duty of the State to enforce religion or morality by statute. He thought it a perilous course, and feared they were coming to a time in which more and more legislation of that character would be attempted. Without saying that the State could never so terfere with advantage he thought the circumstances were rare, much rarer than was commonly supposed, when it could safely act in that way. The enforcement of morality by penalty was open to two great dangers. If they made the penalties severe they would THE DUKE OF ARGYLL said, he bebe likely to lead to a violent reaction in lieved the great evil existed both in the direction of immorality. If they England and Scotland in sending young remembered how the attempts to force chidren to public-houses to get spirits. rel gon on people in the time of the He did not agree with the view exPurrans led to the laxity which pre-pressed by his right rev. Friend (the va ed under the Restoration, they could | Bishop of Peterborough as to the innot feel much encouraged to proceed on tention of Parliament in promoting similar lines to any great extent. There was another serious danger also. The attempt of the State to enforce moral

THE LORD CHANCELLOR (Lord HERSCHELL supported the Amendment, pointing out that the clause as it stood in the Bill would render possible the prosecution of an hotel waiter who should pour out a glass of wine for a child at the bidding of the parent.

legislation of this sort. The object of Parliament in passing some of these measures was for the protection of

MINUTES ) — PUBLIC BILLS - Report Committee-Third Reading -Peterhead Harbar of Refuge 155, and passed. Select Committer-Repat-Hyde Park Corner (New Streets PROVISIONAL ORDER B111-Committee-ReportIird Reading – Local Government (No. (171), and passed CUSTOMS DEPARTMENT-REDUNDANT COLLECTORS. — QUESTION, THE EARL OF LIMERICK asked Her¦ Majesty's Government, Whether the whole of the redundant collectors of Customs were provided for; and whe ther the promotion of the collectors generally would now go on in the regular course?