MR. GILES: Nevertheless, all oppo- is a pure speculation, with full knownents have had a full opportunity of ledge on the part of the promoters that presenting Petitions against it. when Parliament has sanctioned the MR. CREMER Shoreditch, Hagger-construction of a railway there are alston): I feel called upon to oppose the ways a number of people who believe it Bill, because I do not think that it will will pay, and who are ready to subscribe confer any public benefit or convenience. the capital. In the first instance, it I have had the pleasure of walking over appears to me that the line is promoted these beautiful Downs several times in by a handful of men for purposes widely the course of my life, and I very much distinct from that of public convenience. doubt whether, in the first instance, a I think that by the rejection of the Bill railway is wanted at all. There are very we should be really doing the public a few people who travel in this district, and service, and would prevent them from I doubt whether, if a railway were con- investing their money in an unprofitstructed, such as is proposed by the Bill, able speculation. now before the House, the number of people who visit that part of the Island would be greatly increased. I do not believe that the public convenience depends upon the construction of a railway in the Isle of Wight. On the contrary, I believe that the carrying of this under taking would mutilate, if not entirely destroy, one of the most beautiful spots in the Island. Those who are acquainted with this part of the Island know perfectly well that the Downs affected by the Bill are Downs over which the public are free to roam without let or hindrance; and on the ground that the construction of this line would undoubtedly mutilate and destroy the character of that lovely part of the Island I shall certainly oppose the Bill. We have already had some practical experience in connection with railways in the Isle of Wight. I know, of no district in which railway travelling is more expensive. Visitors, I am sorry to say, get the minimum of convenience for the maximum of charge. Only last week I desired to go from Shanklin to Ryde, and from Ryde to Brading; but, to my astonishment, I found that there was no train after 5 o'clock in the evening, and if you do manage to succeed in catching a train you have to pay five times the price you would have to pay in any other part of the United Kingdom. My experience of travelling by railway in the Isle of Wight is not at this moment by any means invigorating I think, therefore, that the House of Commons ought to pause before it consents to grant new concessions either to the existing Companies, or to any others for the construction of railways under similar conditions. Nor do I believe that this particular railway, however cheaply it may be constructed, could by any possibility ever pay. No doubt it

LORD RANDOLPH CHURCHILL (Paddington, S.): I think it is difficult to decide upon the merits of this Bill in the absence of the hon. Gentleman the Chairman of Committees. The Chairman of Committees is the only person who could have given us authoritative information as to the examination which the Bill has received upstairs. It seems, however, to be absolutely certain that, under some technicality or other, such as the Rules which regulate the question of locus standi, and which are extremely technical, the public have had no opportunity of bringing their case before the House of Commons, so that the grounds of their opposition to the scheme might be inquired into. It is quite obvious, from the statement which was made by the hon. Gentleman below the Gangway opposite (Mr. R. Chamberlain), that the public have not had an opportunity of making their wishes known, and that a very strong feeling does exist with regard to the question. Therefore, as the Chairman of Committees is absent, and consequently unable to give his reasons why the House of Commons should finally depart from all control or check in this matter, I think the House will do well to refuse to proceed further with the Bill at this stage. After all, the promoters will not be much damaged. The expenses which they have already incurred have not been very large, and the Bill can be introduced again next year. It must be borne in mind that the Isle of Wight has been without this railway for hundreds and probably thousands of years; and therefore, if the people of that Island have to wait for another 12 months, they will possibly not be injured very materially. It cer tainly does appear, on the first blush of the case, that this is a case of promoters

endeavouring to make a railway for speculative purposes on the so-called property of private individuals. It is not quite certain whether private individuals have full rights over the property through which the line is to run; but if we reject this Bill an opportunity will be afforded for deciding that ques. tion. Therefore, I hope the House will adopt the view of the hon. Member for North St. Pancras Mr. T. H. Bolton, and postpone the Bill for another year, when it will be able to receive full examination. I trust that that proposition will receive the support of the hon. Gentleman opposite the Secretary to the Treasury.

them. As a matter of fact, they have no capital at all; it is a pure speculation altogether, and they want to improve their speculation by tacking another line on to it. The hon. Member for Southampton Mr. Giles) spoke strongly in favour of the project; but the hon. Member did not inform the House that the engineer of the line was his own son.

MR. GILES (Southampton: I beg the hon. Baronet's pardon. It is nothing of the sort. Mr. Cooper is the engineer of the line, and my son has nothing to do with it at all.

SIR JULIAN GOLDSMID: It is very well known that the hon. Member's son is connected with Mr. Cooper.

MR. GILES: Not at all.

SIR JULIAN GOLDSMID: In any case, the promoters of the Bill have projected the line without having at their command any capital at all. In cases of this kind. Committees upstairs generally find that it is proposed to issue a large amount of Stock in excess of the actual cost of the line. This is a method adopted to pay promoters, and is one which ought not to be encouraged. It only enables promoters to make large profits and to realizo a considerable bonus at the expense, and often without the knowledge, of the shareholders. I am certainly of opinion that this system of bringing forward schemes which are purely promoters' lines ought to be discouraged. If the Bill is thrown out this year there will be nothing lost, and I hope the Motion for the rejection of the Bill will be persevered in.

THE SECRETARY 10 THE TREASURY (Mr. HENRY H. FOWLER Wolverhampton, E: I have no feeling in the matter one way or the other. I think there is great force in what the noble Lord has stated as to the absence of the Chairman of Committees. The Motion of my hon. Friend the Member for Islington is to throw the Bill out; and if that Motion is adopted, of course the Bill will be gone for the whole of the year, and it will have to go through all its stages again. But if the House chooses to sanction the withdrawal of the Motion for the third reading, then it could stand over until the Autumn Session. It would be pratically hung up until the new Parliament meets, and the House would then be in a position to re-commit it if it thought such a course desirable, and the whole question could then be fully gone into and fairly discussed. I wish, however, to express no feeling on the matter either one way or the other. I MR. MOLLOY (King's County, Birr): only wish to point out to the noble Lord I think the House ought to be satisfied and to the House that what he wants with the cordial support which the noble can be effected without absolutely throw- Lord the Member for Paddington (Lord ing the Bill out. Randolph Churchill) has given to his SIR JULIAN GOLDSMID St. Pan-new hon. Friend the Member for Islingcras, S.: I wish to say a word with ton Mr. R. Chamberlain). That seems regard to this Bill, because I think to me to be the only interesting feature the House has forgotten one circum-in the whole of the debate; but I should stance connected with it. We are told that the promoters last year ob tained a Bill for the construction of a railway from Shanklin to Chale, which is to be worked in connection with the line proposed by the present Bill. Now, what have they done in order to carry out the powers which Parliament itself granted to them? Nothing at all. They do not appear to be in the slightest

not object to the proposition of the hon. Gentleman the Secretary to the Treasury if it can be carried out, not to destroy the Bill altogether this Session, but to give it a chance of being recomnitted next year, so that we may be able to come to some better understanding as to the real merits of the case. The absence of the Chairman of Committees, who might be able to guide us,

that the course proposed by the Government is the fairest one, as it would give all parties a chance of being heard.

to allow any such churches, places of worship, &c. to be built or repaired; and, whether, under such orders, about thirty schools of Protestants in Syria have been closed within the past few months?

THE UNDER SECRETARY STATE FOR FOREIGN AFFAIRS (Mr. BRYCE) (Aberdeen, S.): I only desire to say one word on the question whether THE UNDER SECRETARY OF the House should dispose of the matter STATE (Mr. BRYCE) (Aberdeen, S.: now, or allow it to stand over until the A letter has been received from the new Parliament. I think it would be Evangelical Alliance within the last few better to dispose of the matter at once. days, forwarding a communication from The objections which have been brought their Committee at Constantinople on forward now are most of them objections the subject of two regulations recently which could not be taken in Committee. issued. Although the description given They are objections which have been of them by the Evangelical Alliance taken on public grounds; but in Com- does not bear out the terms of the Quesmittee the public would have no locus tion, the regulations, if that description standi. It would be difficult, even by a be accurate, appear objectionable in side wind, to bring up this case again, tone and tendency, and in contravention because there is no way of ascertaining of the repeated engagements entered into whether the Bill would be more likely by the Porte for securing religious liberty to be opposed in another Session than it to its subjects. Sir Edward Thornton has been in this. Moreover, the objec- has been instructed to inquire if any tions which have been urged are objec- such regulations have been authoritations upon which the House is just as tively issued, and if necessary to recompetent-indeed, more competent-monstrate. He will, of course, continue to pronounce an opinion than any Committee would be; and, as the Bill cannot pass in the present Session, the best thing we can do is to put the promoters out of their pain at once by rejecting it. Question put, and negatived.

Main Question, as amended, put, and agreed to.

Third Reading put off for three months.

QUESTIONS.

0

TURKEY-RELIGIOUS INTOLERANCE.

MR. DIXON-HARTLAND (Middlesex, Uxbridge) for Sir ROBERT FOWLER) (London) asked the Under Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs, Whether Her Majesty's Foreign Secretary has directed. the attention of the British Embassy at Constantinople to certain orders lately issued to all the Governors General in the Ottoman Empire by the Turkish Minister of the Interior, Munir Pasha, in which orders the schools, churches, places of worship, and societies for benefiting the non-Moslem sects are referred to as "nefarious schemes," and the Governors General are directed, by means of many and scrutinizing investigations, to hinder their work; also that the same officials are directed not

his efforts to obtain redress in any cases of religious intolerance which may come to his knowledge, as well as to endeavour to prevent the recurrence of such cases.

ARMY (AUXILIARY FORCES)-VOLUN

TEERS AT ALDERSHOT.

GENERAL GOLDSWORTHY (Hammersmith), (for Admiral Sir JoHN COMMERELL) (Southampton) asked the Secretary of State for War, If it is true, as stated by The Army and Navy Gazette, that only 3,000 Volunteers (mostly from the home counties) are to be allowed to have a week's training at Aldershot; and, if so, taking into consideration the smallness of the Capitation Grant, which precludes on the ground of expense of the formation of a separate camp, he will reconsider his decision?

THE SURVEYOR GENERAL or ORDNANCE (Mr. WOODALL) (Hanley (on behalf of the Secretary of State): No, Sir; it is not the case. Invitations for Aldershot have been sent for 6,975 Volunteers. Besides these, 1,172 men of the Artillery and Engineer Volun. teers are to join camps at Devonpor Chatham.

ROYAL PARKS AND P*

DENS-KFT
MR. BRADL
for Mr. Howa

Central) asked the honourable Member FELD) Halifax who replied said: The for North West Staffordshire, Whether Irish Government are advised that there the First Commissioner of Works has is no power to take evidence on oath, in arrived at a decision as to the permanent cases such as that of the late riots in opening of Queen's Gate, Kew Gardens, Belfast, without special authority from as necessary to the free use of Miss Parliament. They believe that the matNorth's Gallery a gift to the Nation) ters before the Belfast Commission can and to meet the large influx of visitors be adequately investigated by means of Cumberland Gate and the Lion Gate unsworn testimony. bung too distant)?

tution, the Royal Artillery Institution is altogether regimental in its character and formation. As such it is not considered desirable that questions should be discussed which might give rise to criticism on points of existing military organization; and as the subjects for the prize essay are always submitted for approval that approval was withheld when the subject in question was brought forward.

ROYAL PARKS AND PLEASURE

will consider the desirability of appointing a Consular Officer in that district?

THE UNDER SECRETARY STATE (Mr. BRYCE Aberdeen, S.): No representations have been made by the British Vice Consul at Cuidad Bolivar in the sense indicated by the hon. Member. We have reason to believe that a considerable number of British subjects are employed in the mining districts of Venezuela referred to; and Her Majesty's Government have, consequently, already decided to appoint a

GARDENS-CYCLISTS IN HYDE PARK Consular Agent there.

AND KENSINGTON GARDENS.

MR. BRADLAUGH (Northampton) (for Mr. KIMBER) (Wandsworth asked the honourable Member for North West Staffordshire, as representing the First Commissioner of Works, Whether the

facilities which have been accorded to cyclists as regards Richmond Park can be also accorded as regards Hyde Park and Kensington Gardens; and, if not, what are the causes or reasons which stand in the way?

MR. LEVESON GOWER (A LORD of the TREASURY) (Stafford, N.W.): The First Commissioner cannot admit that the circumstances of Hyde Park and Kensington Gardens are similar to those of Richmond Park; and, looking to the crowded state of the roads in Hyde Park, he is of opinion that velocipedes safely

cannot be admitted.

VENEZUELA-PROTECTION TO

BRITISH SUBJECTS.

WEST INDIAN COLONIES — THE
COMMERCIAL CONFERENCE

AT WASHINGTON.

MR. BADEN-POWELL (Liverpool, State for Foreign Affairs, Whether, in Kirkdale) asked the Under Secretary of the correspondence between Her Majesty's Government and the United States, any arrangements have been suggested or arrived at as to the repre

sentation of the British West Indian Colonies at the Conference on Trade

Arrangements among all American communities, about to be held at Washington; and, whether Her Majesty's Government intend to take part in that Conference on behalf of British communities in America?

THE UNDER SECRETARY

OF

STATE Mr. BRYCE) (Aberdeen, S.): All that Her Majesty's Government know about the proposed Conference referred to in the Question is that a Bill is now pending in the United States Congress authorizing the President of the United States to invite delegates from each of the Republics of Mexico, of Central and South America, Hayti, San Domingo, and from the Emperor of Brazil, to meet delegates on the part of the United States to deliberate on questions and measures for the mutual interest and common welfare of the Ameri

GENERAL GOLDSWORTHY Hammersmith) (for Mr. KIMBER) (Wandsworth) asked the Under Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs, Whether any, and what, representations have been made by the British Vice Consul at Cuidad Bolivar, Venezuela, in reference to the treatment of British interests in Venezuela; whether it is the fact that he has obtained in reply no effectual assist-can States. The British West India ance in his efforts to protect British interests; whether there is a very large community of Englishmen and English Negroes living in the mining district of Venezuela, from which the nearest Eng lish Consular authority is at Cuidad Bolivar, some 250 miles distant by road and river; and, whether, in view of the number of English Commercial Companies employing a very large amount of British capital and British labour, he

Colonies are not mentioned, or is Her Majesty's Government included in the invitation suggested by the Bill; but as the project is still merely in the stage of a Bill, which may or may not pass, and on which, if it passes, the President of the United States may or may not take action, the matter is evidently too hypothetical to make it necessary for Her Majesty's Government to express any opinion upon the objects contem