Anno. 10. Geo, immediate Reduction of Interest and Abolition of Taxes, II. 1736.7. 'tis more than probable our Taxes will not produce so much yearly at the End of 8 Years, as they do at prefent, if Things fhould remain for that whole Time upon the prefent Footing because, if our Trade be upon the Decline, the People will not only be decreafing in their Number, but will be every Year growing poorer: In either of which Cafes there will not be fuch a Confumpt of thofe Com. modities upon which the Taxes are raised, which muft neceffarily diminish the Produce of each of them; and if at the fame Time, we fhould then be engaged in a War, the yearly Produce of the Sinking Fund may happen to be worth little or nothing; in which Cafe, we fhall then be in no Condition either to reduce the Intereft payable upon our public Funds, or to abolish any of our Taxes.

From what I have faid, Sir, it will appear, that if the People continue under all their prefent Taxes for any Number of Years longer, it is probable they muft continue un, der them for ever, or at least as long as they are able to pay them, and if that fhould be their unhappy Fate, we may expect they will not only fhew a Refentment, but that it will at last break forth into Rage. However, it is evident that neither their Refentment nor their Rage will be owing to this Refolution, but to the Injuries and Oppretions they feel; and if the public Creditors are entirely paffive, if they are not active in concerting Measures, as has been threatned, for preventing the good Effects of the Scheme we have agreed to, the Refentment of the People will be no way directed against the Creditors, but against thofe who fhall be found to have mifapplied that Fund, which was appointed for paying them off, and for relieving the Nation from Taxes. The Confequences may, indeed, be fatal to the public Creditors, with regard to the Debt dre to them; becaufe, if the Nation fhould by fuch Means be brought into Confufion, that Confufion may prevent its be ing ever in our Power to pay them any Part of their re maining Principal or future Interest; but that Lofs will arife not from the Scheme we have agreed to, nor from the Re folution propofed, but from the bad Succefs of both; and this I hope every one of the public Creditors will take par ticular Notice of, and will therefore join heartily in premoting the Succefs of the Scheme, instead of concerting Measures for its Defeat.

As all the Arguments made ufe of for fhewing that the Refolution now propofed, can neither contribute to the Revival or Support of our Trade, call it which you will nor to the Succefs of the Scheme, nor to reconciling or pre

ferving

ferving the Affections of the People towards his Majefty Anno 10. Geo.. and his Government; I fay, as all the Arguments made ufe II. 1736-7of for this Purpofe depend upon its not being in our Power to engage for, or bind any future Parliament, I have fully anfwered them already, by fhewing that it is in our Power to bind a future Parliament, to the Abolishing of Taxes, as much as it is in our Power to bind them to the Paying of a Debt; and as the Abolishing of fome of our heavy Taxes is really in itself a valuable Confideration, and fufficient for inducing our Creditors to come into the Scheme, I think we ought to agree to the Refolution, on Purpose that the World may fee, that a future Parliament cannot in Honour and Justice refuse to abolifh fome of the Taxes, as foon as the Interest is reduced to 3 per Cent. because it would be a defrauding the public Creditors of the Confideration which was promifed them, and which was the principal Inducement for their agreeing fo unanimoufly to accept of 3 per Cent. for their Money.

With refpect to the Scheme itself, Sir, it fignifies nothing to me who was the Author of it; but if the Hon. Gentleman had no Share in its Conception, I am fure he or fome of his Friends have added a very confiderable Limb to it, and fuch a Limb too, that if any Mifcarriage happens, it will certainly be owing to that Limb which they have added. If they had propofed no Improvement or Addition, if they had not in fome Measure obliged Gentlemen to agree to what they propofed, I am convinced the Scheme as it was first offered would have had the wished-for Scccess; and if they think that what they have added will render it abortive, they are in the right to disown their being the Authors of the Scheme; but that will not prevent People's imputing to them the whole Blame of the Mifcarriage. However, as I think the Scheme, even as it ftands now, may meet with Success, and as I think the Refolution now proposed to us will very much contribute to that Succefs, therefore I fhall be for agreeing to it."

The Debate being over, the Queftion was put upon the Motion, and carried in the Negative by 200 to 142.

The principal Speakers in this Debate were, Sir John Barnard, George Lyttelton, Efq; Samuel Sandys, Efq; Mr. Alderman Perry, William Pultney, Efq; and George Speke, Efq; for the Motion; and Thomas Winnington, Efq; the Lord Baltimore, Walter Plumer, Efq; and Sir Robert Walpole, against it.

On Friday the 2nd of April, Sir John Barnard presented to the House, according to their Order before mentioned, a Bill for redeeming all the public Funds redeemable by

Law,

Anno 10. Geo. Law, which carry an Interest of 4.1. per Cent. per Annan, II. 1736.7. or converting of the fame, with Confent of the Proprietors

Sir Robert
Walpole.

Sir John
Barnard.

into a lefs Intereft of Annuity, not redeemable till after the Time therein to be mentioned; which was read a firt Time, and ordered to be read a fecond Time.

On the 29th of the fame Month, the faid Bill was read a fecond Time; and a Motion being made for committing it, the fame was oppofed, upon which there enfued a long Debate.

In this Debate, all the Arguments for and against the Reduction were repeated and enforced; but as we have already given a full Account of most of them, we shall add nothing more upon that Subject. The other Part of the Debate related chiefly to fome Informalities and Imper fections which were pretended to be found in the Bill, by those who were against its being committed; because they faid they were fuch as could not be properly altered or amended in the Committee. On the other Hand, those who were for committing the Bill, infifted, there were no Informalities or Imperfections in the Bill, but what might eafily be altered or amended in the Committee, with the Affiftance of thofe Gentlemen concerned in the Treasury, who were to be fuppofed beft acquainted with the Method of drawing up fuch Bills, and who, 'twas to be prefumed, would give their Affiftance to the Committee, tho' they had refuted to give any Affistance or Advice to thofe Gentle men who were ordered to draw it up. But as what was faid upon this Subject cannot be well understood without a Copy of the Bill, which we have not Room for, there fore, we shall give no further Account of it. Only we must take Notice, That Sir Robert Walpole, in a Speech he made against the Queftion, spoke to the following Effect, viz.

"I know, Sir, it has been afferted without Doors, that the Honourable Gentleman who first mentioned this Scheme to the Houfe, had several private Converfations with me upon the Subject, and that we had concerted and fettled the Scheme between us, before he offered it to the Houfe; but I shall declare, that he and I had never any private Converfation upon the Subject, nor had we ever any Concert about this Scheme or any other Scheme I know of; therefore, I can with great Confidence affirm, I had never any Hand in this Scheme, either in its original Formation, or in any Shape it has fince appeared in :"

Sir John Barnard ftood up, and anfwered in Substance thus:

"I am very much obliged to the Honourable Gentleman, Anno 10: Gro Sir, and therefore, I thank him for vindicating me from II. 1736-7. the Imputation of having had any private Converfation with him, or of having ever had any Concert with him; and if he is afraid left People fhould fufpect his having had a Hand in the Scheme I propofed to you, I fhall be equally juft to him by declaring, I never had any private Converfation with him about it, nor did I fo much as ask his Approbation or Confent to what I was to offer; but as to the Scheme as it now ftands, every Gentleman that hears me, knows it is very different from what I offered; and every one likewife knows that the new Model, which is the Model we have now before us, if it was not offered by the Honourable Gentleman himself, it was at least offered by fome of his Friends, and what they propofed was agreed to by other Gentlemen, in order that we might have their Affillance in carrying it through. Therefore the Scheme now before you cannot properly be called mine; and it is very remarkable, that all the Objections made to the Bill, are only to thofe Articles and Claufes of it, which relate to the Improvements and Additions made to my Scheme, by the Honourable Gentleman's Friends.".

Upon this John Horve, Efq; ftood up, and among other John Howe, Things, took Notice, That the Scheme then before them Efq; feemed to be like a Baftard Child that had feveral reputed Fathers, neither of whom would own it: For his Part, he faid, he thought it a very hopeful Child, and therefore if no other Gentleman would take it as his own, he would; for he did not doubt of the Child's thriving, and if it did, it would be an Honour to its Parents.'

The Speakers in this long Debate, were as follow, viz.

For committing the Bill, Sir John Barnard, Sir Wilfred Lawson, the Lord Baltimore, John Howe, Etq; Sir Thomas Sanderfon, Mafter of the Rolls, Samuel Sandys, Efq; Sir William Windham, Sir Edward Bacon.

Against committing the Bill, Sir Robert Walpole, Sir Charles Wager, William Sloper, Efq; Mr. Alderman Heathcote, Robert Knight, Efq; Peter Burrel, Efq; Colonel Bladen, William Bowles, Efq; James Oglethorpe, Efq; the Lord Sundon, and Sir William Younge.

Upon the Queftion's being put, it was carried in the Negative, which put an End to the Affair for laft Seffion. After the 11th of March, when the Motion for granting a Million to his Majefty towards redeeming the like Sum of the increased Capital of the South-Sea Company, commonly called Old South Sea Annuities, was agreed to, there was no remarkable Debate happened in the Committee of

Supply;

Anno 10. Geo. Supply; nor was there any remarkable Debate happened II. 1736.7. upon any of the Refolutions of the Committee of Way and Means, except that relating to the Duty on Sweets, therefore we shall take no farther Notice of any other Re folution of that Committee; but as this Affair relating to the Duty on Sweets occafioned feveral long Debates, we fhall give fome Account of it. The first Time it was mentioned, was on Monday the 7th of March, when the proper Officer was ordered to lay before the House an Account of the nett Income into the Exchequer of the Duties on Sweets, for seven Years ended at Michaelmas then lait, diftinguishing each Year; which was accordingly prefented the very next Day; and on Friday the 18th of March, the House having refolved itself into a Committee, to con fider further of Ways and Means for raifing the Supply granted to his Majefty, and the faid Account having been referred to the faid Committee, Sir Robert Walpole rofe up, and after a fhort Speech, moved for the first Refolution relating to the Duty on Sweets, which, after a long Debate, was agreed to: Then the fecond Refolution relating to the fame Affair was moved and agreed to; and the House having, upon the Report, agreed to both these Refolutions, a Bill was ordered to be brought in, which, after long Debates, was paffed into a Law.

In thefe Debates, the Arguments for the Refolutions, and afterwards for the Bill, were in Subftance as follow, viz.

SIR,

By the Refolutions we have already come to, in the Committee of Supply, it will upon Calculation appear, we have granted his Majefty, for the Service of the enfuing Year, a Supply of about 2,025,000 /. Now as the LandTax and the Malt-Tax which we have granted, do not both together amount to 1,700,000/. there will be a Deficiency of near 400,000 /. which must be provided for, either by increafing fome of the Taxes we have already. or by granting fome new Tax, or by taking fo much from the Sinking-Fund, or laftly, by the Method I have thought of, and which I fhail presently explain to you. As for in creafing any of the Taxes we have already, or impofing a new one, I do not think we can make good the Deficiency by either of these Ways; because I do not think the People can well bear any additional or new Tax, and the attempting of any fuch Thing, may alienate the Affections of great Numbers of the People from our present happy Eftabishment, and may contribute towards increafing thofe Moba and Tumults, which have of late been fo frequent all over

the